Porkulus Maximus: GOP Turncoat Senators Exposed; Final Senate Passage 61-37; Conference Next
It looks like the Senate came up with a deal on the so-called stimulus bill:
Senate Democratic leaders struck a deal with a handful of moderate Republicans late Friday on a leaner economic-recovery package and pushed for a vote after five days of partisan deadlock over a plan that had swollen to $930 billion.
Senate leaders valued the compromise, struck on the same day as the government announced the loss of nearly 600,000 more jobs in January, at about $780 billion, although some aspects of the plan remained unclear late Friday. The deal’s proponents said the new plan would cut spending for an array of projects, such as $870 million for pandemic flu preparedness, included in the earlier House and Senate bills. …
White House aides refused to call [the] cuts a defeat for the president. Instead, one called it “a strategic retreat” to get the bill into House-Senate negotiations and off the Senate floor where it was being picked apart.
“Wait til conference,” another White House aide cautioned. The reference was to the House-Senate conference that will shape the final bill. …
Mr. Reid had to compromise to win the handful of Republicans he needs to swing behind the president’s plan and pass the bill. Democrats control the chamber with a 58-41 majority. But they need Republican support to achieve the 60 votes needed to ensure passage of any measure.
Two Republican senators — Susan Collins of Maine and Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania — endorsed the package, Friday night.
Massachusetts Sen. Edward Kennedy, who has been ill, was flying back to Washington Friday night to bolster the vote for the plan.
But Senate minority leader Mitch McConnell, (R-Ky.) Friday night criticized the compromise plan, and said the plan is “not likely…to produce the results we desire.”
The tenacity of the Republicans’ opposition to the stimulus plan in the House and Senate has appeared to catch the Obama administration off balance.
RedState.com reports on the turncoat Republican Senators:
Multiple sources are reporting that Republican Senators Arlen Specter, Olympia Snowe, and Susan Collins have reached an agreement with Democrats on a final $780 billion version of the so-called “stimulus” package.
Way to sell out your team, folks.
Pamela Geller, Ms. Atlas Shrugs herself, is reporting:
Here are the GOP turncoats. Call now. Call back if it’s busy.
Collins (202) 224-2523
Snowe (202) 224-5344
Specter (202) 224-4254
Update: AtlasShrugs continues to report:
U.S. Senate Contact Information:
SENATOR SUSAN COLLINS
DC PHONE: (202) 224-2523
DC FAX: (202) 224-2693
AUGUSTA PHONE: (207) 622-8414
AUGUSTA FAX: (207) 622-5884
EMAILS TO CONTACT:
[email protected]
[email protected]SENATOR OLYMPIA SNOWE
DC PHONE: (202) 224-5344
DC FAX: (202) 224-1946
BOSTON PHONE: (207) 622-8292
BOSTON FAX: (207) 622-7295
EMAILS TO CONTACT:
[email protected]
[email protected]SENATOR ARLEN SPECTER
DC PHONE: (202) 224-4254
DC FAX: (202) 228-1229
HARRISBURG PHONE: (717) 782-3951
HARRISBURG FAX: (717) 782-4920
EMAILS TO CONTACT:
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]
Update: HumanEvents.com relates what’s happening now:
America’s future in freedom hangs in the balance as three RINO senators on Friday announced they will join Democrats in their scheme to move this country irretrievably down the path to socialism. Senators Arlen Specter (R-Pa.), Susan Collins (R-Maine) and Olympia Snowe (R-Maine) have indicated they will vote for the $1.3 trillion “stimulus” spending bill that purposes none other than precisely that outcome. The non-partisan Congressional Budget Office ruled that less than 20 percent of the bill could in any way be considered stimulative.
The vote for cloture in the Senate is scheduled for 5:30 pm today. If cloture is invoked, debate would end on the 778-page bill that was not released to the Senate until 11:00 pm Saturday.
At noon on Tuesday the bill will be subject to another 60 vote hurdle by either waiving a budget point of order or achieving 60 votes on final passage. This bill that will ground this country in socialism will have passed the “greatest deliberative body in the world” with only one small window of debate on the bill as actually written on Monday afternoon.
These three Republican senators should forever be held accountable for bringing unfettered socialism to bear on the American people. Remember their names — Specter, Collins, Snowe — and let this forever be their legacy.
Update: The GOP strikes back — Rep. Mike Pence (R-IN):
Sen. John McCain (R-AZ):
My question is, aren’t there any Democrats at all who are going to vote “Nay” on this bill?
At least in the House there are significantly more reasonable voices. This is what Rep. John Linder (R-GA) had to say in an email to opponents of the bill in the House:
It is evident that our nation is in the midst of an economic crisis. In order to provide our lethargic economy a much-needed boost, the Democrat-controlled House of Representatives introduced H.R. 1, an $825 billion stimulus proposal that attempts to spend our way out of the current recession. While I agree that the Federal government has a role in restoring the prosperity of our nation, it is naive to believe that spending $6 billion weatherizing private homes, $600 million to train physicians to prepare for universal healthcare, $400 million for NASA to study climate change, or $50 million to repair cemeteries – all of which are included in this package, has the capacity to restore and grow our economy. I, along with every Republican Member of Congress, opposed H.R. 1, when it passed the House on January 28, 2009, by a 244-188 roll call vote.
While the terms “hope” and “change” are commonplace in Washington, D.C., these days, uncertainty is what envelops American taxpayers. In fact, the only certainty that exists is that compounded with our existing $10.6 trillion deficit, the long-term costs of this proposal will burden future generations. Even more alarming is the observation from the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office that only 7 percent of the spending included in the proposal will be realized in 2009, while two-thirds of the spending will occur in 2011, the very year economists forecast the end of the recession. This fact certainly undermines the premise of a stimulus for a timely, temporary, and targeted economic recovery.
I fear that Depression-era spending of this nature will only encourage Depression-era conditions. The cornerstone of an effective stimulus must be jobs; not jobs artificially created by growing the government in both size and significance to individuals’ lives, but private sector jobs where innovation and accountability exist in practice, not solely in theory. Under the Democratic stimulus proposal, 4 million jobs are promised to be created; a noble goal. However, when questioned during consideration of the stimulus bill in the Ways and Means Committee, a representative from the Joint Committee on Taxation could not verify that even a single new job would be created. Even assuming 4 million jobs are created, at a cost of $206,000 per job, this figure is roughly four times the average earnings of private sector employees. This is yet another example of a government plan that offers low results at a high cost; a gamble our sick economy cannot afford.
Instead of taking a nearly trillion dollar gamble, I believe the path to our economic recovery can begin by implementing H.R. 470, the “Economic Recovery and Middle Class Tax Relief Act,” legislation I have co-sponsored which provides tax relief to families and encourages businesses to invest and innovate. Families will experience relief through a 5 percent reduction in income taxes, increased child tax credit, and protection from the Alternative Minimum Tax. Businesses will be able to make projections into the future and create new jobs knowing their tax rates will be stable, investments will be incentivized, and losses can be recovered. Providing individuals and businesses the ability to project for the future brings certainty to the forefront and calms fears. Americans deserve a stimulus that can provide long-term solutions, not just another excessive spending spree by Democratic leadership.
-Phil
62 responses to Porkulus Maximus: GOP Turncoat Senators Exposed; Final Senate Passage 61-37; Conference Next
These 4 Reppublicans need to be tar and feathered. I hope they get fired next election as they have let the American people down!!! Way to go idiots!
To voice your opinion’s………..
You can add the RNC # 202-863-8500
DNC # 202-863-8000
Let it be known………
The Mother of all Bomb’s has now been replaced by
The STIMULOUS BOMB which will put “us” in dept plus our children,
our grandchildren, our great-grand children, and our
great-great-grandchildren and beyond. (who do not even have a say
in this matter.) Oh, but don’t worry about it, my great-great grandchild will pick up the tab! Let them worry about it.
This passing of the “buck” is a disgrace. A bogus manuever to cover
the Obama Administration for year’s.
When are people going to realize that ONE BILLION DOLLAR’S =
ONE THOUSAND MILLION DOLLAR’S…
BESIDE’S A “TRILLION” DOLLAR’S, WHAT’S NEXT…
A ‘ZILLION’ DOLLAR’S, A ‘BAZILLION DOLLAR’S, OR ‘GAZILLION’
DOLLAR’S? (or your soul)
THIS IS INSANE……DAN
(does anyone know what a thousand trillion dollar’s is called?)
wiki say’s “quadrillion” with a question mark?????????
Why did I know Voinovich was on that list without even knowing or asking (R-OH)?. He’s the same a-hole now as when he was governor here.I didn’t vote for him even though I’m a Republican. Thank God he says he’s not running again in 2010.
WORD IS OUT: OBAMA PUT OUT THE PROMISE, THAT WHOLE BAILOUT PROGRAM IS TO CREATE GIGANTC ARCON / GOVERNMENT JOBS FUNDED BY YOUR GRANDCHILDREN!
I guess I can add a new nick name for single bullet/Scottish law Arlen. Its now single bullet/Scottish law/stab m’ in the back Arlen Spector (CD) PA. The CD is for closet democrat, but he really never went in the closet. He started out as a democrat, put on the wolf’s suit and told everyone he was a republican, and now the wolf’s suit is off. Welcome home you scumbag.
Eric
I truly hope that I am completely wrong, and this bill actually helps. Times are rough out there, many people loosing jobs and families are struggling to survive. This bill failes to generate 2.4 million jobs as promised, and once again lines the pockets of the super elite, and leaves my children with an insurmountable deficit, then the econcomy will be MUCH MUCH WORSE. Sometimes change isn’t good. On the other hand, they can always start building camps for the poor and political non-conformers with some of the money…..oh wait…
I do not think that Voinivich is one of the turncoats. On his website, it says that he did not support the compromise.
http://voinovich.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=NewsCenter.PressReleases&ContentRecord_id=4da84955-fea7-fda1-8b90-9436b2e83eac
I really worry what this bill will do to our economy. Mainly, I worry about its inflationary effecct.
Work continues this weekend.
Voinovich did not compromise.
Concentrate on
Snowe
Collins
Spectre
Jackie
Actually, they compromised on bill precisely in hopes of keeping their jobs. Specter is target in 2010. Snowe and Specter are both from states that went strongly for Obama in the election. We are going to pressure them too and there are more of us progressives than the regressives now.
RC
Reality Check,
However, on this fact we can both agree:
This bill is not about stimulus, it is about Democratic spending, and nothing more. Should you have children or ever decide to do so, the debt that this will produce will be mortgaged on your and my childrens’ grandkids.
This is no longer about progressive, regressive, right-wing, left-wing, or wingless; this is about sinking the country into such a debt hole that we may have to actually default within the next 20 years. This bill, along with everything else with which the federal government has saddled itself, will produce more interest payments on the debt than some aspects of entitlement funding, over time. This is a very, very dangerous game to play with this nation.
I really do hope you see and realize this. If you’re still honestly in support of this bill (and I don’t know if you are or not as of this comment), at least be intellectually honest with yourself and realize this is simply a bunch of pork — much of which won’t be realized for another few years, precisely when some of these blow-hards are running again for office (how convenient is that?).
Thanks for the comment,
-Phil
I will side with Nobel Laureate economist Paul Krugman vs. Phil the nice guy conservative blogger thank you. My biggest problem with the bill is that the tax cuts should have been postponed until later. We will start working on the deficit in a couple of years when the economy is stronger by raising taxes on the ones who made out like Viking plunderers under Reagan and Bush II. Supply side economics will then be tossed in dust bin of history for once and for all.
Reality Check,
In which case, following along the First Amendment, I have no problems with [might as well be] admitted socialists such as yourself commenting on my blog.
Welcome. Again.
-Phil
Please, please, stop listening to these false accusations of treachery.
The real truth is that government spending IS the stimulus the economy needs now. This is really basic Macroeconomics. Economists have known it is true since Keynes published The General Theory in 1936!
But the conservatives didn’t listen then, and they aren’t listening now. We the people do not need to follow them.
Instead, we should listen not only to Keynes, but to a modern Econ Nobel Prize winner, Krugman, who explains it all very well at http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/06/opinion/06krugman.html?_r=1&em
Yes, the Nobel Prize winner says we NEED this stimulus and we need it ASAP.
I have good news for you. You are completely wrong, the bill will help. Unfortunately, since tax cuts do not help the economy, it will not help nearly enough. But you have your Republican friends in Congress to thank for that. For it was at their insistence that Congress replaced billions of dollars of spending with these useless tax cuts.
Now don’t get me wrong: I would love for my tax burden to be reduced. I have paid and will still pay way too much in taxes. But I refuse to confuse my personal interest with the good of the nation. I know that tax cuts do little or nothing (usually nothing) to stimulate the economy.
Now you don’t have to take my word for this. You can take the word of an Economics NObel PRize winner who says much the same at http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/06/opinion/06krugman.html?_r=1&em which is also a surprisingly good read.
Phil,
Senator Voinovich’s own web page published a story dated Feb 6 that he stands opposed to the bill.
Carol, you and I disagree about Voinovich. I was disappointed that he didn’t answer my questions about POTUS eligibility. At least he wasn’t spewing that spoon fed nonsense about Obama being natural born, and the Hawaii Health director confirmed it. Voinovich didn’t answer me directly either way.
But, I am not surprised that he opposes this economic suicide bill. He has been called a budget watchdog in the Senate; sound fiscal views on most things. I believe that.
Matt J.,
Interesting comments on your part. It’s almost as if you’re still living in the 1930s right along with the rest of the national Democratic party.
Note to self: the Dems in DC haven’t figured out that capitalism never died in the 30s and it’s certainly not going to die now, as much as they’d like to have heaps and tons more central planning for the American economy.
Thanks for the comment,
-Phil
JinOhio,
That’s why I’ve updated the posting as such.
Thanks for the comment,
-Phil
Phil
I am not a Socialist. That is a tag that the regressives love to toss out willy nilly. I am both a Democrat and a democrat.
RC
I sent a fax and told them besicly If they vote for it they are FIRED!
I have a problem with your statement “my personal interest with the good of the nation’.
How is good for the nation to enslave our grandchildren and possible great-grandchildren with such a debt? What child deserves to be born into slavery of a nation. To consume a debt that they had nothing to do with because of the selfiness of a generation?
The good of the nation is to stop passes the responsiblity to the next but rather to be responsible for own acts.
This stiumuls packages does nothing to stimulate the nation but rather a choice elect of people.
I see nothing in this package that would truely be beneficial to the long term needs and protection of this nation.
Where in it, does it allocate the funding to get us off of oil dependancy from other countries? Where is the coal tech. that we need? Where is the wind/solar plans?
And Matt, I don’t need to take your word or some other person’s award for it. I can think for myself and see the problems with this bill. I don’t need to have an award under my belt to know what I know and I surely don’t need someone with an award under their belt telling me how it all works.
I truly love it when someone quotes a Nobel Prize winner, especially in the economy. The ‘economy’ is a living breathing animal, which for the most part is unpredictable. Carter’s economic guru’s said that Reagan’s economic plan wouldn’t work, yet it did just that. Jimmy Carter’s economic plans were a dismal failure yet had backing of many ‘experts’. The one true economic stopper is high energy prices, so get your carbon taxes fired up. Oh…by the way…what is beryllium 10 and why does Al Gore not want to talk about it?
Phil
I have noticed that there seems to be a coordinated attack on New Deal from the Right. It is if they are scared to death that it will work once again. The reason that Obama might be turning back to the 1930′s for guidance is that the Republicans have acted like they did in the 1920′s to got us into this mess. It was a lethal combination of deregulation, tax cuts, wealth concentration in the upper few percentile, and speculation that were the causes of Great Depression. Does that sound vaguely familiar?
Who is better on the economy? Here is some interesting information from Dr. Ravi Batra’s website*:
Table 1: Poverty Rise under Various Presidents; 1980-2008
President …………………………Jump in Poverty Figures
Reagan………………………………..+ 3 million
Bush I………………………………..+ 6 million
Clinton……………………………….- 6 million
Bush II……………………………….+ 5 million
Increase in Family Income
Bill Clinton (1993-2000) $8,600
G W Bush (2001-2006) – $990
and
President GDP Growth Job Creation Manufacturing Jobs
Clinton (1993-2000) 3.7(%) 23 million 450,000
Bush (2001-2007) 2.8(%) 5 million - 3.2 million
* Some of the figures for G W Bush are from last year and would be even worse if they were updated.
I like to deal in facts and not just slogans and name calling, hence my handle. It is OK to call someone a moron if they are demonstrably a moron. My message to Conservatives is this: You failed, that is why you lost, now get out of our way and let us fix it. We’ve done it before and we will do it again.
Reality Check
Reality Check,
In my opinion, I think you ought to embrace and enjoy socialism just as much as you are wanting to embrace and enjoy this “stimulus” bill
-Phil
Maureen,
There’s a phrase that goes accordingly: “The highway to hell is paved with good intentions.”
“Common good” works very similarly. Many actions have been justified in the name of the “common good,” of which there is no such thing. Societies are made up of individuals, and if individual rights are not preserved, the entire society will soon fail.
If only everyone were to read Ayn Rand’s “Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal,” they’d immediately see the absolutely asanine farce that we call the “common good.” The difference between being equal under law versus an equality of means (socialism) is that, under law, everyone has the opportunity to fail or succeed. An equality of means brings everyone down to the least common denominator, based on the fact that the natural realm is filled with scarce resources. As such, an equality of means simply spreads misery around to everyone, equally — except, of course, for those in charge.
I believe it was Abe Lincoln who once said, basically, that you cannot promote the welfare of man by tearing down the rich, nor can you benefit the poor by giving everything to them, thereby disabling their initiative to become better human beings.
History, repeating.
-Phil
Reality Check,
Calling you a socialist is by no means an ad hominem attack, as you seem to be making it out as such. Do you know what the definition of a socialist is? Allow me to enlighten you:
From dictionary.com:
socialism
An economic system in which the production and distribution of goods are controlled substantially by the government rather than by private enterprise, and in which cooperation rather than competition guides economic activity. There are many varieties of socialism. Some socialists tolerate capitalism, as long as the government maintains the dominant influence over the economy; others insist on an abolition of private enterprise. All communists are socialists, but not all socialists are communists.
socialist
adjective
1. advocating or following the socialist principles; “socialistic government” [syn: socialistic] [ant: capitalist]
noun
1. a political advocate of socialism
Hence, if you believe that the government taking over more and more of the nation’s economic output is a good thing, you are, by definition, a socialist.
In juxtaposition, I am a capitalist:
cap⋅i⋅tal⋅ism
–noun
an economic system in which investment in and ownership of the means of production, distribution, and exchange of wealth is made and maintained chiefly by private individuals or corporations, esp. as contrasted to cooperatively or state-owned means of wealth.
Capitalist
Cap”i*tal*ist\, n. [Cf. F. capitaliste.] One who has capital; one who has money for investment, or money invested; esp. a person of large property, which is employed in business.
Yes, I do have some capital that has been used towards investment in certain businesses (otherwise known as stock ownership).
Also, I am of the following school of thought:
laissez-faire [(les-ay-fair, lay-zay-fair)]
French for “Let (people) do (as they choose).” It describes a system or point of view that opposes regulation or interference by the government in economic affairs beyond the minimum necessary to allow the free enterprise system to operate according to its own laws.
I do believe I rest my case with respect to your viewpoint, as well as mine.
And, incidentally, I don’t measure the success of programs in terms of the number of people who have exited poverty. Rather, I measure the success of programs in terms of how much opportunity is given to individuals. As the Bible says, the poor will always be among us precisely because of the choices that people make. I would much rather live in a society that allows for individual empowerment than one that has the government control the methodology of empowerment.
After all, whatever it is that the government can give to an individual, it can also take the same away. In my view, that’s insanity at its highest degree.
Thanks for the comment,
-Phil
Obama is an exceptionally shrewd politician. He has figured out that all you have to do to get the Republicans to cave in is to throw them a bone in the form of a tax cut.
But guess what? America absolutely cannot afford tax cuts. If the government wants to give us tax cuts, it must first cut government spending to pay for the tax cut.
Write your senators and congressmen and demand that there be no tax cuts until the government cuts spending. Your honesty will help move the country in the right direction.
In this article you link, Mr. Krugman writes, “The crisis began with housing, but the implosion of the Bush-era housing bubble has set economic dominoes falling not just in the United States, but around the world.” Thus, he reserves his most stinging criticism for the Republicans, notwithstanding the record would indicate, the Democrats are largely responsible for the housing mess. I am not disparaging Mr. Krugman’s economic expertise; I am merely pointing out, his politics appear to be getting in the way of his economics. (Thanks for the link. I stopped reading the NYT based on their stilted reporting during the primary season.)
Let’s face it. If this bill is approved, the money will be in the administration’s hands and can be spent on anything at any time.
Normal controls will not apply. After all, we are looking at a “catastrophe”?!
At one time, Mr. O charged up all his credit cards until they were refused. He sounds like a bad credit risk to me.
Bush set the precedent by using TARP funds for the auto bailout.
Is there anyone that would be able and willing to hand deliver some letters to the Capitol today or early in the morning tomorrow? We could email the letters to you and you could print them out.
Snowe and Collins are shutting out the public. The numbers to their fax machines ring at night and are busy during the day. Their phones are busy or the mailboxes are full. Email can be ignored or filtered. Snail mail takes three weeks to reach the offices. I wonder what the government does with FedEx’s. Hand delivery is probably the only sure way.
Voinovich must have changed his mind then. I sent him an e-mail re: this, and did get a response that he was going to vote for it. But that was before Feb. 6. Maybe he bowed to pressure. I, like some others, are calling this “The Obama-Pelosi Theft Act of 2009.” I fail to see where any jobs are going to be created and how this will put money back into the system. I think it would be wiser to give everyone (IRS evaders, crack addicts excluded) the $17,000 this is going to cost per person. THAT is the way to put money into the system. If I got that money, I would immediately invest some in the stock market and probably take a trip. Others would pay down a mortgage. How is putting $500,000,000 aside for people to convert to digital TV going to accomplish anything, for example? Most companies are giving the converters away or charging peanuts for them because they want the service business. As Margie, from “Fargo” would say: “I just don’t understand it.”
Hey Biz, fax them this on pink paper, but center it and put it in huge black letters:
“NOTICE:
TERMINATION OF EMPLOYMENT
YOU ARE HEREBY NOTIFIED THAT “WE THE PEOPLE”
HEREBY GIVE NOTICE THAT YOUR SERVICES OR LACK THEREOF
ARE NO LONGER DESIRED OR REQUIRED!
YOU ARE FIRED!
FINAL NOTICE SHALL BE RECORDED ON ELECTION DAY 2010, AT WHICH TIME YOU WILL BE OVERWHELMINGLY VOTED OUT OF OFFICE.”
I sent a couple of these out already. I say kick the bums out. All 535 of them.
Hey, Reality Check:
If you haven’t done so already, check out Phil’s update on “Brunner Attacks Greenberg.” I would LOVE to hear your comments.
Phil
I see you are a Rush follower. He coined the term “Porkulus”. The GOP has picked up on that from their defacto leader. I think it is funny that Rush would use the term “Porkulus” since that term immediately has another connotation when Rush uses it. He must not have had his daily dose of hillbilly heroin when he came up with that one.
RC
Reality—–What planet do you live on. How do you figure there are more progressives than regressives….this is an ignorant comment!! Are you referring to Christians as regressives?? Please show me your source of information for this comment. Last time I checked….90% of Americans believe in God and want the Constitution upheld!!! Are you in the 10% or the 90%???
There are always those who believe raising taxes and letting the government take control will cause a rapid growth but they are wrong. If the ‘Fair Tax’ was adopted big government would have to give control back to the people. Big government doesn’t want this to happen because they would loose their power over the people they now depend upon to keep them in power. Too bad all those tax and spend thinkers are dead wrong. Look at some of the countries that have lowered corporate taxes and see how much money they take in on taxes. It is best to lower tax rates not raise them. It takes a true Democrat to say raising taxes will help when it has proven otherwise. And put the blame on this crisis where it belongs. It is not Bush’s fault. It rests solely on those who wished to raise taxes and kept control of the financial institutions at bay because they thought it best to do so. These people are Democrats and some Republicans. Too bad, for now the states are starting to revolt over the big government control and are invoking resolutions of independence. If Pres. Obama was a leader he would be leading, instead he is back on the trail campaigning. It is time for him to stop and look at what he is leaving behind for his children and his grandchildren.
Phil:
I believe Reality Check was scared off. Good job, you did. Some people just can’t see common sense in anything and RC is one of them. Or, maybe he just likes the power that he feels he has over these poor, seemless souls. He can’t even see that only a small portion (after you told him) of these funds will be spent this year and the bulk will be spent during the election year. Or maybe he does, I’m not sure. However, the small amount they are doling out this year will only cover the 600 additional employees the federal government are adding to their roles. You hit the nail on the head. It is a dangerous act on their part. What they hate the most is that we won’t jump on board with their idiotic ideas. They certainly don’t want to take the blame for anything, now do they. As you said, everyone has the opportunity to do for themselves, that is equality – not robbing others of their success to give to themselves. I dread for our future generations.
vcw39,
The truth of the matter is that when government lowers taxes (allowing individuals/corporations to keep more of their money), it always ends up with more revenue coming into the government (otherwise known as “supply-side economics). This is because if you let the “evil” rich keep more of what they earn, they end up making more investments and creating jobs, thereby allowing the cycle of creating even more taxpayers paying taxes into the treasury.
One would think this has become painfully obvious with experience and history.
Thanks for the comment,
-Phil
Phil and VCW39,
You both just made statements for which there is ZERO proof. Under both Bush’s and Reagan the debt grew because the effect of the tax cuts failed to generate the advertised revenue that the supply-siders said that it would. I am amazed that in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary that supply siders still believe cutting taxes for the wealthy and corporations stimulates the economy. It obviously has moved into the realm of religion. Most of the same people believe in the invisible man in the clouds too.
Does anyone know with what the Service Employee International Union (SEIU) is affiliated? I know they put pressure on Bank of America to get of their CEO. And they, along with Moveon.org and others are pressuring the Republicans into voting for the stimulus package.
Please listen to this person who has talked to the Democratic officials in Chicago talking about what they are going to do with the money and why they do not want to disclose how they plan to spend it.
The Dems are trying to use this stimulus money to create jobs that will make people vote Democratic forever if they want to keep their job. This Stimulus bill will take away the two party system and there will be no reversing it.
We need to demand that our representatives do not pass this or anything like it.
This is why Obama wanted to pass it so soon and so fast. He didn’t want people to figure this out. He hoped it would be too long for people to read and sort through. The real programs he has hidden will guarantee him voters in 2012.
This country will be doomed if there is only one party.
Could it be that Obama wants to be so much like Lincoln that he would start a Civil War on purpose?
Reality Check,
As a socialist, I realize you’re conveniently forgetting the fact that while, for example, Reagan cut taxes, Congress still outspent the tax cuts. Therefore, using the 1980s as an illustration for a completely black-and-white analysis of, “Well, he cut taxes, but that simply meant we got into so much debt,” isn’t quite as straightforward as you’re trying to make it.
I will repeat again the fundamental principle of all of this: what we give the government to control, the government has the power to take away. Via the 16th Amendment as passed in 1913, we the People gave the federal government the power to tax income. Therefore, the government has now intruded in everyone’s daily lives by requiring us (just go ahead and “volunteer” to not pay taxes) to report who we are, what we do, how much money we make, and why we’re justifying taking all of the deductions and credits we’re fully entitled to do. In fact, that’s part of the fallacy of the “Alternative Minimum Tax:” the “evil” rich were legally taking all the deductions allowed by law, allowing those individuals to pay nearly zero in income taxes. What’s the problem with that picture? Congress then, in the 1960s, decided to “make” these people pay “their fair share?”
Do you not see the game that Congress plays with you and me? It’s a vicious cycle — pitting one group against the other, in a constant rhetorical struggle that takes place almost for the sole purpose of Congress fleecing everyone while putting up a smoke screen that keeps most people from seeing what’s really going on.
And what’s really going on? Government is the most corrupt organization out there. What — you think business is the really corrupt industry? Hardly. As the bumpersticker says: “Don’t steal — the government hates competition.”
Reality Check, as I’ve said before, if you choose to be a socialist, that’s your prerogative; the libertarian side of me continues to look upon people such as yourself with such fascination as to why you’d want so much government in so much of your life, only to turn around and complain that one party or the other is driving our nation into bankruptcy.
-Phil
I really like the way that Barry O. and his gang keep pushing in our face “We won and you didn’t so we are going to do things our way now. The people voted US in”. It’s like a bully and his gang controlling a block of the city. It’s his way or the highway, Hell or high water. Right or wrong. He just wants to use and abuse his newly acquired power not caring for the long term consequences. It looks to me as if his Dems are running the show and he is trying to keep up with them… I can only hope that some conservative Dems see this for what it is and ask to start over with a truly “stimulus only” bill that will take effect quickly, and not over a longer period of time. My prayers are for the ones who are voting wisely on this for our childrens futures and not for their own gratutious benefit.
I have been calling, emailing and faxing versions of the message below for the past week. I’ve sent it to both Democrats and Republicans, in the House and Senate. Please use this form or your own, but by all means, keep up the pressure.
Senator/Congressman,
Thank you for your service. Your vote on the proposed Economic Stimulus/Spending Plan is important. You have a fiduciary and moral obligation to the people you represent. The overwhelming majority of your constituents do not want this Bill to pass in its present form.
The proposed Economic Stimulus Plan ($780,000,000,000.00) is far too much spending and not enough stimulating! It should be cut to a maximum of $400 billion and ONLY be used for tax cuts (for those who pay tax), immediate infrastructure projects (all expenditures within the next twelve months) and help for struggling home owners! The rest (Pork) can wait until our financial picture has improved. Until than, you must vote NO! Your reelection will be measured by your voting record.
Thank you,
EMAIL LIST FOR SENATORS STAFF
http://www.wnd.com/
Communist: Obama working to nationalize U.S. economy
PORKULUS MAXIMUS: GOP TURNCOAT SENATORS EXPOSED
________________________________________
I Didn’t Speak Up
by The Reverend Martin Niemoller
In Germany, the Nazis first came for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Communist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a Jew.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn’t speak up because I wasn’t a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Catholics, but I didn’t speak up because I was a Protestant.
Then they came for me…By that time there was no one to speak up for anyone.
Email to the 3-4 (R)Senators for the Stimulus Bill, information came from Congressional Staff Directory. A lot do not have the email address but by looking at the emails below you can make it up from the staff names in the book. (found at most libraries)
[email protected]
[email protected]
…must answer questions to send to Senator not to staff and give city-use Bangor, ME 04402, 555 Anystree(or any name).
[email protected]
[email protected]
..must answer questions to send to Senator-not to staff, give city –use Augosta, ME 04330 , 555 Anystreet
[email protected]
..must answer questions use-Harrisburg, PA 17101, 555 Anystreet
[email protected]
[email protected]
..must answer questions, use-Columbus, OH 43215
[email protected]
…must answer questions, use-Fresno, CA 93721, 555 Anystreet
The following are the staff members direct Emails(no questions) from Congressional Staff Directory-Web access http://csd.cqpress.com
Sen Arlen Spector staff (can cut and paste all to email)
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
Sen Dianne Feinstein staff (can be cut and pasted in total)
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
Margaret_sewell@feinstein.senate[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
[email protected],
http://www.senate.gov/general/resources/pdf/senators_phone_list.pdf
Print off list of Senators for master list
http://www.avweb.com/other/senemail.html
Senator email list
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
..to find Senator home city and zip code
http://www.conservativeusa.org/mega-cong.htm#Michigan
….fax numbers of all Senators
hi all, have not posted in a long while but have been keeping up with this site and several others. I have been very busy faxing, emailing, calling and snail mailing. I have now given up on Collins and Snowe. I hope they enjoy their last terms in office.
One more thing to try, and I hope to elicit your support and efforts. I have appealed to some Republican senators from other states, asking them to talk to Snowe and Collins, since they obviously aren’t listening to their constituency.
Please add your voices, faxes and emails to mine, on this somewhat different tact.
Phil said:
And what’s really going on? Government is the most corrupt organization out there. What — you think business is the really corrupt industry? Hardly. As the bumpersticker says: “Don’t steal — the government hates competition.”
I have worked for several large corporations and yes they are as “corrupt” as government. You have been listening to morons like Rush, Hannity, and Grover Norquist too long. Enron and Halliburton were more corrupt and on a larger scale any body of government has ever been. There are corrupt politicians but we can vote them out. Corporations answer to no one except the government regulators and there has been no regulation for 8 years. They no longer answer to the stockholders thanks to stacked and incestuous boards of directors.
Corporations have all the rights of individuals but have no conscience. That was not always the case. Corporations were given the same rights as individuals in a questionable ruling in Santa Clara v Southern Pacific Railroad.
So Phil, if you wish to choose to be an uninformed regressive, ignorant of facts, that is YOUR prerogative.
Reality Check,
I am sorry that your socialistic tendencies have made you all but give up on the free enterprise system, arguably the least imperfect system every devised to create more wealth for more individuals than any other system in history, on the face of the planet.
Socialism, fascism, communism and terrorism are all enemies of individual freedom and liberty. They all seek equality of outcomes, which shall never be achieved, due to the fact that all of humanity is flawed.
And before you get too comfortable with the government being the be-all end-all “good Samaritan” for society, remember that you can leave a corporation of your own recognizance; the government operates via coercion at the point of a gun.
-Phil
Very important as the fight will continue:
DO NOT BOTHER WITH SNAIL MAIL ON URGENT MATTERS. SNAIL MAIL WILL NOT REACH THE CONGRESSIONAL OFFICES FOR AT LEAST THREE WEEKS. ALL INCOMING MAIL MUST BE IRRADIATED TO KILL ANTHRAX AND CHECKED FOR OTHER THREATS.
Mail to all offices in Washington is probably processed in the same way: to Cabinet members, President, Supreme Court, Pentagon, Etc.
Why do this, you ask. Do you remember when a letter containing anthrax was mailed to Congress after 9/11? The office building was closed for weeks and fumigated.
I emailed the top officials of the GOP party in Maine. Since I’m not from Maine, I expect my effort was trashed.
The Offices for the Senators from Maine were unreachable by the public for the last four days. The fax machines did not pick up at night and were “busy” all day. The phones were busy. Snail mail was diverted for treatment and testing. The email could be ignored, filtered, or flat deleted.
Do you suppose that we can do too much, where we will be just totally tuned out?
Reality Check,
LOL, you like to deal in your select figures, not facts. Do you mind adding the above, adjusted for inflation. Please include Jimmy Carter, since you only have one other democratic party POTUS in your figures, Bill Clinton. Please explain how the socialist democrats under Jimmy Carter fixed things, since you have done it before as you say.
Single bullet theory/Scottish Law/Stab m’ in the back Arlen Spector is a lost cause. I have been calling all of his numbers 10-20 per day for the last 2 weeks. I very rarely get thru. I also call the Capitol switch board and several times today it was busy. WOW. The one time I got thru I asked the operator if Spector’s phone has been ringing off the hook today. Her response was, “TODAY, its been ringing off the hook for more than a week”. He is giving us the finger which is par for the course for him.
Eric
Some #’s that don’t add up.
1st Bama says his stimulus bill will creat 3-4 million jobs. Sounds good except for that fact that there is 11.5 million on unemployment and rising. I evan have heard that 50 million jobs could be lost in 2009. Sounds like penuts now.
2 heard last knight that 200billion to be put aside for the states. Wow how thoughtfull. Except that California is $48 billion in debt. I am no math metician, or Eco guru. But 200 billion devided by all our states, well you get the picture.
3 california counties are suing California (in daily bulletin paper) as they don’t have enough money to servive. And San Bernardino county says they have enough money to go through March.
Arlen Spector has always been an evil little rat. This is nothing new from him–but he ditched his party and the people in Pa that voted to keep him in. Too bad for his cancer–maybe he will fall under the new healthcare system and his is too far gone for any more treatment–same as Kennedy–and they should be made to resign just on the principals that they don’t have all of their mental abilities–the chemo and the oxyicotton dictate control.
Maybe if someone brings his medical condition up to him and can convince him he is wrong–he will retract his vote.
I, too have tried to call him and the other two traitors but their lines are busy so emails work as well. I will send all 3 an email again tonight
Something else they have in the stimulus package that they are trying to slip passed everyone is computerized national database of medical records. Can you imagine what someone could do with this information if they got their hands on it. It would have your name, ss#, address, phone number, insurance info, account info, diagnosis and medications, etc. I can see job discrimination, education discrimination, unconsented research privileges and much, much more. We need to contact our senators and representatives to make sure this is taken out of the stimulus package.
Reality Check–I agree with Jackie, which planet did you beam down from? What makes you think that there are more progressives than recessives (a term I loathe because of its negative connotation)? You think that just because BO won the presidential election that there are more of you now? You, who believe in abortion on demand, assisted suicide, and euthanasia? How could there possibly be more of you now than before, since you spend so much time murdering your young and helping the depressed and elderly die early?
I’ll tell you how…ACORN. Say what you want, ACORN stuffed the ballot box in many states. BO didn’t get elected because of his stance on the issues, he got elected because ACORN (and the MSM) cheated to get him elected.
FYI, the wealthy’s tax rate is already high…they find ways to shelter their money from taxes. The old mantra of “spread the wealth” really has no teeth, because wealthy people know how to manage their money with the greatest tax advantages.
Middle class people are the ones who make up the bulk of the tax revenue received, did you know that? Middle class people make good salaries, but spend almost all of it just raising their children and providing for their family.
Poor people don’t pay any tax. I am among what I call the working poor. The wage I make barely covers rent and utilities. Were it not for a wonderful hospital in my town that gives financial aid, we’d be bankrupt all the time trying to find money to pay medical bills, when every paycheck is consumed with just meeting the basic needs of food, shelter and clothing. And for us, clothing doesn’t get addressed very often because food, shelter and utilities get it all.
Despite all that, I can still tell you that BO is full of it when he tells you that the world is coming to an end if congress doesn’t pass this stimulus (aka porkulus) bill. Trust me, business leaders who drive their company into the ground need to be allowed to fail. They need that lesson, otherwise we just prop up the current dysfunctional system. CEOs who lead their companies into failure should not be allowed to pay themselves “performance bonuses” on the taxpayer’s dime. I just wish that Congress had the balls to ask for AIG’s money back, plus all the others who took bailout money without doling it out to ease the credit crisis.
Speaking of credit crisis, you can thank Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, ACORN and, yes, Barack Obama for the housing demise. They were the ones who pushed banks to make risky loans to poor people or people who were buying more house than they could afford. Good grief! This isn’t rocket science, risky loans lead to risky results in terms of payments and foreclosures.
Let me say this loud and clear: NO STIMULUS, PLEASE! Let them fail and learn a few of life’s lessons in the school of hard knocks. Of course, it doesn’t matter anymore what I think because of the turncoat republicans who voted with the dems to pass the pork laden stimulus package. Since the package was mostly pork, with the exception of a few tax cuts, we’ll still have the opportunity to see the stupid CEOs and their businesses fail. Even the Congressional Budget Office opined that there was only about 10-20% of that bill that could actually be considered stimulus.
I think BO is a highly educated idiot, and that he has surrounded himself with other highly educated idiots and criminal friends. Since the “progressives” seem to be in control for the next two years, we’ll just have to grit our teeth and bear it. Lord, I hope 2010 is a better year, and I hope that BO has made enough mistakes by that time that we get a republican/independent congress elected.
Linda, a new party is already forming, called America’s Independent Party. Google them, they have a website and you can even affiliate yourself there. Hopefully BO’s “stimulus” doesn’t affect them, also.
Jackie Smith
Not all Christians are Regressives. I think most of them from the South are though. In case you slept through the last election the Progressives won.
Jackie Smith
The study on religion (that you failed to site) is not correct or is outdated. A recent Pew research study of 35,000 Americans found that the group that said they had no religion was the second largest group at 16%. The largest group was Catholic at 23.9%. Evangelical Baptist was 3rd at 10%.
From my anecdotal experience many Americans who identify themselves as Catholic or some other religious affiliation are not really believers but just say that to avoid the atheist or agnostic label for social reasons. I spent some time in Europe in recent years and religion is fading fast there. I think a recent study showed that in Sweden almost 70% were non-believers.
I think the trend in the US is toward secularism as people become more educated and as the social environment changes to be more tolerant of the questioning of unsupportable religious fantasy. The religious crowd realizes that critical thinking and science are their enemy so they are trying their best to pollute it with poppycock like Intelligent Design and regressive “politically correct” science that attempts to put fantasy (Creationism) on equal footing with science (Darwinian evolution). This movement is doomed to failure for, as they say, “The Emperor has no clothes”.
Reality Check,
I realize that you appear to have some angst against those of us who believe in something more than The New York Times or one’s favorite statist dogma, and that’s fine. To be bitter against any and/or all segments of Christianity is certainly your prerogative, but you’re not hurting anyone else except yourself with such sentiments as you’ve just expressed.
While this posting has nothing to do with theology, I happen to have a passion for the subject, at least as much as I do with politics and technology. I think that the only thing that needs to be said RE: your insinuation that those of us who believe what the Bible says do not critically think about issues is that Darwinian evolution requires at least as much faith as does believing in Creationism.
Why is that? Quite simply: nobody can go about reproducing “the beginning,” and, hence, it takes faith either way to believe that everything’s completely random (which happens to go against certain laws of physics) or that there’s a purpose for everything. This is primarily due to the fact that science could be defined (this is my definition that I think is rather succinct) as “observing [primarily repeated] behaviors in the natural realm.” So, if we cannot reproduce the beginnings of things on the same scale as the universe, then all we’re left with is evidence and faith.
Again, I don’t want to sidetrack this commentary thread into a theologically-based discussion, and I’m not saying that certain aspects of evolution (such as micro evolution) don’t exist. I am simply attempting to push back on you that not all Christians are “Lemmings of the Church(tm);” some of us do, in fact, question things.
Thanks for the comment,
-Phil
any liberal who thinks taxing is the way out of the financial mess that their social welfare programs created only needs to look at the liberal state of California, right now.
42 billion in the red, and growing.
want more proof?
how about the fact that we are rapidly approaching 10 trillion in debt, that is $25,000 + in taxes for each tax paying American.
I say ENOUGH, more than ENOUGH. The libs can come up with the fake facts they want, the fact remains liberal socialism is a failed experiment. It is time to get the illegal aliens, the obamas, the 1960s kool aid drinking hippies off the dole, and get back to a free market based system which has proven to worked for past 250 years. Obama lies when he says tax cuts led us here, no, it was and remains (since it hasn’t been fixed yet) the social housing welfare program started by CARTER (easy loan programs), furthered by Reno/Clinton/Obamb red districting, ignored by Frank and Dodd, and pushed over the edge by George Saros on Sept 18, 2008 when he made massive credit derivative swap outs in the market tilting the election toward usurper obama. Saros is the same far left wing toon banned from trading in Europe for trying to bring down England with lopsided currency trading.
Everything I say here is the truth, check it out per google function.
Phil
I have never heard quite that definition of science and I think it misses the point in an intentional way. Science is used all the time to make inferences about what is not directly observable. Did you ever read any quantum mechanics textbooks? We have never directly seen a black hole but the probability that a large one exists in the center of our galaxy is extremely high. It is certainly a better explanation than a old man in a white robe is there spinning it around like a top.
I do not really want to argue religion either as it is completely pointless to argue with believers since they can twist any set of circumstances to fit their belief. My favorite is when christian athletes praise almighty god for their victories but don’t seem to place equal blame when they lose. They don’t ever seem to wonder why god would take such interest in a silly sporting event when he must have more important things to do like stirring up wars all over the globe, allowing planes to crash, and letting earthquakes occur to kill innocents by the thousands.
My initial point was to make an an observation that people who seem to buy the conservative dogma on tax cuts and evil government without proof are very likely to be the same ones who buy into religious delusion. I believe there is a connection that is more than circumstantial.
Reality Check,
The point of the issue is that people such as myself see government as a necessary evil and the least imperfect way to maintain order in society. Further, since government should not be teaching morality but rather upholding moral standards (which is right for it to do), it is up to the church, in my opinion, to be the societal bulwark of what is right (despite its many flaws).
And remember, it’s not necessarily “dogma” to preach and/or believe in low taxes and an overbearing government.
-Phil
These “leaders” showed they lack a Backbone. Conserving resources is everyone’s concern. The whining from Senator Collins still echoes. Pelosi’s pig pack reached across the whole country now!! Imagine! No wonder she is smiling so much.